Egg & Milk Powder

[Ken_Griffiths]

I have done some extrapolation calculations based on the two different sizes of egg/milk carton to establish how much egg and milk powder is used per cup of flour. Here are those calculations:

Egg/Milk Powder Bag 12oz (340.194g)
12oz (340.194g) bag divided by 75.598728333 (150g) = 4.5g Egg/Milk Powder Per Cup of Flour

Egg/Milk Powder Bag 9.4oz (266.485g)
9.4oz (266.48g) bag divided by 75.598728333 (150g) = 3.525g Egg/Milk Per Cup

I don't know the egg to milk powder ratio, but I tend to use 2 milk to 1 egg:

So if I am not using fresh eggs/milk wash, I add approx. 1.5g egg powder and 2g milk powder per cup of flour.

I should add that in some additional research, which I won't bore you with here, I have reason to believe it is actually ’egg white powder' and 'skimmed milk powder' that they use today at the KFC outlets.

Anyone who lives in the UK can buy both these powders easily from Sainsburys supermarket.

Sorry I can't help where to get them in the U.S.

I will say that using the egg/milk powder does give better colouring to my finished fried chicken. You can't however ’beat' fresh eggs .. (Forgive the pun).

If anyone has any ideas as to why the egg/milk carton changed size between 2008 and 2013, I would love to hear from them.

Ken

[Deleted]

At this link you can hear CHS specifically state "Milk and egg wash."



I don't know if he meant fresh milk/eggs or the powdered products.

[Ken_Griffiths]

heavyg,

The colonel originally (and most often) used 'skimmed' low fat milk and fresh eggs as a dip prior to applying the seasoned 'breading' flour, mixed with salt. It was certainly the 'corporation' that later introduced the egg/milk powder. I presume that was to prevent the spread of salmonella and improve the shelf life of the products. It was obviously far more convenient to use in the stores too.

There are videos on YouTube where the colonel demonstrates his frying techniques on TV programmes in the 1960’s and he always uses a fresh egg/milk wash.

[Deleted]

I've used both fresh and powdered forms. For me the powdered didn't effect the flavor as much as the fresh counterparts. However the powdered eggs and milk were either too expensive or difficult for me to obtain. I noticed the colonel shaking all of the egg wash off the chicken before breading.

Maybe that's where I was going wrong, I was taking the chicken right from the wash and breaded it.

[Ken_Griffiths]

I find that if I use egg/milk powder instead of fresh egg/milk wash, it is (slightly) less-likely that the breading will burn. So my guess is the 'corporate' coating is less volatile and will stand the slightly higher temperatures. So it's probably also better for the texture and taste, mainly in a busy corporate environment, aswell as being safer to use.

I still use fresh eggs and milk at home ... It's important that the mix is not too cold. The chicken also needs to be close to room temperature and not straight out the fridge.

The coating should be 'fine' almost like a thin layer of talcum powder and not 'cloggy' .. Think of it as one quick, but thorough, overall dusting. The breaded chicken should also not stand around ... No more than five minutes before it enters the pre-heated hot oil.

After frying the corporate chicken pieces, they are then placed in a steam-filled holding 'chamber' to keep warm and this helps soften the coating and makes it adhere better to the chicken. This takes approx. 20 minutes or so, before it is then transferred to the main public display cabinets for service.

If the chicken is not sold from the main display cabinet within 90 minutes... It is discarded.

For more info about the 'steam filled' holding-cabinets have a read of this Winston Shelton news article as an introduction to his work with the Colonel:

www.louisville.com/content/winston-shelton-colonels-corporal-food-dining

[ThePieMan]

I woke up this morning mulling this issue over, as part of my ongoing thoughts about gravy and cracklings. I'm a little surprised by the above statements about the impact on flavour between fresh and powdered. Well, I shouldn't be, in hindsight.

The powdered egg is most likely, as Ken surmises, egg white powder, whereas the fresh egg milk wash is whole egg. Thus, a significant contributing factor to flavour is the egg yolk. It would be interesting to see how these above comments compare when fresh egg white and skim milk is used cf skim milk/egg white powder.

My thoughts however, were along the following lines: fresh eggwash is used as a glue or binding agent to hold the breading onto the chicken, as it cooks in hot oil, the water evaporates leaving a sticky paste behind that bonds the flour and sets. This creates a concentrated flavour layer between the chicken and the seasoned breading. It should be relatively unnoticeable as the chicken and the seasoned breading ought to be stronger more dominating flavours. "Ought" is the operative word.

In light of this, powdered egg withe and skim milk distributed throughout the seasoned breading does something altogether totally different. It sweetens the breading, primarily due to the lactose sugars in the skim milk powder, and ought to contribute more to the mailliard reaction leading to a slightly crisper breading. At this point its effectiveness as a contributor to sticking the breading to the chicken is highly debatable and imo dubious at best.

The PieMan
Shanghai.

[ThePieMan]

Jan 26, 2015 9:35:02 GMT Ken_Griffiths said:

I have done some extrapolation calculations based on the two different sizes of egg/milk carton to establish how much egg and milk powder is used per cup of flour. Here are those calculations:

Egg/Milk Powder Bag 12oz (340.194g)
12oz (340.194g) bag divided by 75.598728333 (150g) = 4.5g Egg/Milk Powder Per Cup of Flour

Egg/Milk Powder Bag 9.4oz (266.485g)
9.4oz (266.48g) bag divided by 75.598728333 (150g) = 3.525g Egg/Milk Per Cup

I don't know the egg to milk powder ratio, but I tend to use 2 milk to 1 egg:

How many bags are added to a breading lug, do you know Ken?

In what order are the ingredients listed on the egg-milk powder bags?

Cheers.

[Ken_Griffiths]

TPM,

Just the one bag of egg/milk powder is used AFAIK ... here is the 12oz one which is used with 3lb salt and 25lbs flour etc.


Click to enlarge image.

On a separate note...

By the way I have purposely kept out of the KFC Gravy discussion, as it was not widely used here in the U.K. in fact they are pushing the gravy more these days in recent TV advertising, but I don’t recall seeing the gravy as a young man growing up in the U.K. It was often just Chicken and Fries that were sold here and later they introduced coleslaw and/or beans in tomato sauce.

I can only assume the gravy was not popular in the U.K. for some reason?

I can honestly say I have never seen it to buy in store (until recently) and I have certainly never (ever) tasted it. Sad eh?

[Ken_Griffiths]

TPM,

So if you were to have 26oz Seasoning, 25lbs (400oz) flour, 3lb Salt and 12oz Egg/Milk Powder and want to break that down exactly to a smaller portion. Here are three steps to do that.

Step 1 - show all things in ounces
26 oz Seasoning
400 oz Flour
48 oz Salt
12 oz Egg/Milk Powder

Step 2 - half the quantity
13 oz Seasoning
200 oz Flour
24 oz Salt
6 oz Egg/Milk Powder

Step 3 - swap to grams
13g Seasoning
200g Flour
24g Salt
6g Egg/Milk Powder

CONCLUSION
I chose to use 4g Skimmed Milk Powder and 2g Egg White powder for every 200g of flour (a 2:1 ratio)... Hope that helps ?

[ThePieMan]

Cool, thanks Ken.

When I was a lad and we would go to the Kentucky Fried Chicken Store for a, "Treat" (the treat was to order anything else coz the chicken was rubbish) We would get usually 2 pieces of chicken each, buttered corn on the cob, french fries, and mashed potato with gravy. The buttered corn was good, and mushy soft, but the chips, gravy and mash was the best! We'd dip our chips into the mash and gravy using the chips like a spoon. As such chips had to be crisp, the gravy runny enough and the mash also just loose enough to hold the gravy and not turn into a grey-brown puddle of wallpaper paste. These days my son continues the tradition with the chips, gravy and mash.

So... gravy was, and still is, a big deal with us.

[Ken_Griffiths]

TPM,

There’s another thing, I can’t recall ever seeing mash potato at a KFC outlet either, when I was young.

It was just fries (I think?) and the takeaway cardboard boxes had little packets of Salt to add to the meal if you wanted it ... and a sealed 'wet-wipe' tissue to wipe the grease/oil from your hands.

So no mash potato and no gravy, back in those days ...to the best of my memory.

I’ve never had the mash or the gravy. It was just chicken and fries here in the U.K. I wonder why we were different over here?

It makes me wonder if the main recipe was perhaps different too, in various countries, just to cater for local tastes and traditions and maybe adapted for use with the local supply chain.

[ThePieMan]

Isn't that a curious thing about KFC? I believe that the "Original Recipe" chicken offered in each country is the same, all except for the source of the fresh chicken pieces. From my experience in Asia, I do not believe they prepare the chicken from fresh, but that it might actually come pre-breaded due to the relative ease of IP infringement as well as the strong copycat competition, especially in China. But, that is just my speculation. However, in various countries the menu has also included localised dishes to supplement the main offerings, so Hot & Spicy Chicken seems to differ in heat from locale to locale, then wraps and salads, breakfast menus, lots of congee options, here in China, soups, corn on the cob etc. Its really easy to get immersed in one menu system, develop favourites then go to another country only to be disappointed that your preferred options are not on the menu. (That happened to me with McDonalds... I could always get a hot chocolate in China but when I landed in Oz? Nope! Nada, zip!)

Cheers,

ThePieMan (TPM)

[sirius]

Jun 26, 2018 14:03:37 GMT Ken_Griffiths said:

TPM,

There’s another thing, I can’t recall ever seeing mash potato at a KFC outlet either, when I was young.

It was just fries (I think?) and the takeaway cardboard boxes had little packets of Salt to add to the meal if you wanted it ... and a sealed 'wet-wipe' tissue to wipe the grease/oil from your hands.

So no mash potato and no gravy, back in those days ...to the best of my memory.

I’ve never had the mash or the gravy. It was just chicken and fries here in the U.K. I wonder why we were different over here?

It makes me wonder if the main recipe was perhaps different too, in various countries, just to cater for local tastes and traditions and maybe adapted for use with the local supply chain.

same here never seen mash or gravy back in 70s/80s maybe it was trialed in london but mash with fries is in my opinion you choose one of not both lol although i cant say no to fillet tower meal..that hash brown just is acceptable even though u got fries.